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     marriage is about love
       anyone can get married

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raynelightning

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well i just wanted to speak my peace on the whole gay marriage subject. well we shouldn't even be debating this. i know that when i got married that they didn't ask me my religion or make me take my pants down to make sure that i was in fact a woman. the point is this, marriage is not a religious thing for on;y godly people to do. i am not a christian and i am married, oh my god,! can you believe that? so even athiests and devil worshippers and pagans can get married, so it is not a christian thing. so therefore i think that anyone who loves another person should in fact be able to marry that person to show there love and to share their lives together.
 


Posts: 2 | Posted: 03:36 AM on July 6, 2005 | IP
handsomeman

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Yeah, really, but people arent so smart to realize that gays arent all ass grabbing sinners.  But anyway, marriage is about love,not what god thinks.
 


Posts: 13 | Posted: 11:36 PM on February 14, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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There is irony in that last post.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 10:04 AM on February 15, 2007 | IP
handsomeman

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True, but marriage in my opinion, has evolved from just gods beleifs.
 


Posts: 13 | Posted: 6:34 PM on February 15, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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I'm not sure I'd say it has "evolved".  After all, it was originally a life-long commitment between two people who loved each other.  Now, half of everyone who gets married gets divorced and many others don't bother getting married in the first place.  Sounds like it's going downhill to me.  


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 7:25 PM on February 15, 2007 | IP
handsomeman

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Maybe so, but I meant the fact that marriage is a part of almost every religion, not just christianity.
 


Posts: 13 | Posted: 7:27 PM on February 15, 2007 | IP
rockclimber_10

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raynelightning made a pretty good point with the first post...I would like to hear EMyers reply to it.


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"God is most certainly not threatened by science; He made it all possible...science is not threatened by God; it is enhanced"
 


Posts: 52 | Posted: 01:10 AM on February 16, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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God created marriage.  Just because someone doesn't believe in it, doesn't mean it's not true.  Just as someone not following the law doesn't keep the law from applying to them.  The definition of marriage has been around for thousands of years.  Why does it confuse you people so?


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 10:52 PM on February 16, 2007 | IP
rockclimber_10

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I think you missed the point. Lets just say we all agree that God created marriage...and we agree about the definition. If we agree about these two things, then we see that people, like raynelightning, who are openly atheist and are allowed to marry (which is against the Bible), how can we say that allowing gays and lesbians to marry would destroy the sanctity of marriage?

I wonder how many people arguing against gay marriage have had a divorce? I can think of nothing more destructive to the sanctity of marriage than divorce.


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"God is most certainly not threatened by science; He made it all possible...science is not threatened by God; it is enhanced"
 


Posts: 52 | Posted: 12:00 PM on February 17, 2007 | IP
handsomeman

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That is a good point rockclimer, but emyers, from my point of view, its like saying jews cant get married, cause apparently people think that they killed jesus.  If anything is destorying the sancity of marriage, its has vegas, were people get married cause they had too much to drink.  
 


Posts: 13 | Posted: 12:40 PM on February 17, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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There is nothing more destructive to the sanctity of marriage than divorce (or at least the adultery which would allow it).  However, as you just stated, the definition of marriage has already been defined.  Ergo, a man and a man, or a woman and a woman, etc. CAN'T be married.  Sure, they can live together (so can heteros), they can have sex outside of wedlock (ditto), but they cannot, by its very definition, be married.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 8:29 PM on February 17, 2007 | IP
handsomeman

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Thats true, maybe we should just make a new word or something for gay marriage, somehing that gave them the same rights as married couples, but would still make the christians happy, lol.
 


Posts: 13 | Posted: 9:14 PM on February 17, 2007 | IP
rockclimber_10

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EMyers, you completely dodged the question (although I'm getting used to it with you) but I'll pose new questions.

If everyone must meet the Christian definition to get married, why are atheist/agnostics allowed to marry? Why are non-virgins allowed to get married? Is there not hypocrisy in your argument?

Would you be against civil unions for gays and lesbians?

The fact is, marriage is controlled by the government. They have the authority to allow gays and lesbians to marry (or enter a civil union).

Do you think religion should dictate what the government decides, and apply only the man/women Biblical interpretation? Or do you think we should apply all of the Biblical interpretations mentioned above? Or...?

(Edited by rockclimber_10 2/17/2007 at 11:30 PM).


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"God is most certainly not threatened by science; He made it all possible...science is not threatened by God; it is enhanced"
 


Posts: 52 | Posted: 11:24 PM on February 17, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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In reverse order... I'm confused.  What other biblical interpretations of marriage are there?

"Marriage" may be controlled by the government, but it certainly wasn't created by it.  The definition of marriage precedes any government currently in existence.

Civil unions for g&ls doesn't affect me in the least, as long as you don't try to teach my children that this is acceptable (after all, many things are "acceptable" in some cultures, but that doesn't mean they are right).

You're answering your own question.  Atheists/agnostics are allowed to marry because 1) they are human beings and God created both human beings and marriage and 2) because government controls the "legal" definition of marriage.  As we all know, legal definitions often have nothing to do with reality.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 02:59 AM on February 18, 2007 | IP
rockclimber_10

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Now I'm confused. First you said, "Gays CAN'T get married because of the definition of marriage" and now you saying, "Atheist/agnostics are allowed to marry because they are 1. human and 2. because the government controls marriage." Where is the exception to rule for Atheist and agnostics that g's&l's don't meet?

As far as the Biblical interpretation confusion...the point I was making is that if we allow atheists/agnostics and non-virgins to get married, and anyone married to get divorced (all of which is against main stream interpretations of the Bible), why should we deny g's&l's marriage?


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"God is most certainly not threatened by science; He made it all possible...science is not threatened by God; it is enhanced"
 


Posts: 52 | Posted: 4:55 PM on February 18, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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Because, by the very definition of the word, it can't happen.  I can say that I will now allow people to breathe underwater (without scuba gear, et al) but that doesn't mean they can do it.  Sure, I can now say that breathing under water means jumping rope, but it doesn't actually mean that they are REALLY breathing underwater.  God created everyone.  He created marriage.  Marriage is the union of a man and a woman.  The tie is until death (or until adultery, at which case the innocent party is free from their commitment).  Divorce for any other reason is a legal proceding and has nothing to do with an actual nullification of the tie in God's eyes.  I (if I were a rule over my own country ) could make it "legal" to murder.  Doesn't mean that it is right or that it is acceptable before God.  I think you are confusing legality with morality.  The two rarely meet these days.  Sure, you can state that atheists are not beholden to God's interpretation of marriage because they don't believe in Him.  I'll try that argument if I ever get pulled over for speeding.  "But officer, the speed limit doesn't pertain to me because I don't believe in it."  I'll let you know how it goes.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 10:44 PM on February 18, 2007 | IP
K8

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So let's give homosexuals the right to marry under the law, then.

If what the law says is marriage differs greatly from the "reality" of marriage found within the Bible, then we can give them this right without worry and anyone opposed to this can be comforted because they are not really "married" in God's eyes.

There, everyone's happy!
 


Posts: 292 | Posted: 06:26 AM on February 19, 2007 | IP
rockclimber_10

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So let's give homosexuals the right to marry under the law, then.

If what the law says is marriage differs greatly from the "reality" of marriage found within the Bible, then we can give them this right without worry and anyone opposed to this can be comforted because they are not really "married" in God's eyes.

There, everyone's happy!


That is exactly what I was trying to get at, but I was waiting for EMyers to use the words "in God's eyes" before I said it.

So now, EMyers, we have another problem...you must mean one of three things (but the way you stated it, it isn't clear what you believe):

1. "it can't happen,"

Meaning those who don't meet the Bible's definition of marriage cannot and are not married in the eyes of God (including atheist/agnostic/gays/lesbians/adulterers)? Stated like this, I interpret you mean it can't happen legally or in God's eyes.

2. "a legal proceding and has nothing to do with an actual nullification of the tie in God's eyes."

If divorce can happen legally but not in God's eyes, I would assume you believe marriage can happen legally but not in God's eyes. Considering this, maybe you believe some people are only legally married, while some people are legally married and married in God's eyes? I don't really know what you believe at this point.

Or 3. "Sure, you can state that atheists are not beholden to God's interpretation of marriage because they don't believe in Him.  I'll try that argument if I ever get pulled over for speeding.  "But officer, the speed limit doesn't pertain to me because I don't believe in it."  I'll let you know how it goes."

Now it seems that you believe everyone that is married today is married both legally and in God's eyes...and they (the one getting pulled over) will some day have to face God (the police)...and at that point will have to explain why they got married?





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"God is most certainly not threatened by science; He made it all possible...science is not threatened by God; it is enhanced"
 


Posts: 52 | Posted: 7:28 PM on February 19, 2007 | IP
stariennight

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Emyers thinking is about as dangerous to this country as radical islam is to this world! Using
his definitions, my argument would be GOD
created me, GOD doesn't make junk, GOD knows very well HE/SHE/THEY created a pagan homosexual. My relationship with my lady rivals
any truly loving relationship on the planet. GOD is not a tool or weapon, but an ideology.


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star3953
 


Posts: 15 | Posted: 10:29 AM on March 15, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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I think God would beg to differ.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 12:14 AM on March 16, 2007 | IP
stariennight

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What would GOD beg to differ with?

The tool thing?


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star3953
 


Posts: 15 | Posted: 09:13 AM on March 20, 2007 | IP
stariennight

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What would GOD beg to differ with?

The tool thing?


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star3953
 


Posts: 15 | Posted: 09:13 AM on March 20, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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No, the "visionary theorizing" thing.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 1:42 PM on March 21, 2007 | IP
stariennight

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Lets see...., people were getting "married" before people created Christianity. I believe it is one of the newest if not the newest religion on this planet. So, why is it the Christians get to define marriage?


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Posts: 15 | Posted: 3:44 PM on March 22, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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That's providing you believe the myth that "Christianity" was created by man.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 5:23 PM on March 22, 2007 | IP
stariennight

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Ok, so "IF" Christianity was not created by man, it is still a newby in the religion catigory, so I repeat, why do Christians get to define marriage?


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star3953
 


Posts: 15 | Posted: 5:39 PM on March 23, 2007 | IP
EMyers

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Christianity/Judaism are not "new" in the religion category.  And Christians do not define marriage, it was defined for us by God.  I thought that was obvious.


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"Thou believest that God is one; thou does well: the demons also believe, and shudder." James 2:19 - Belief is never enough.
 


Posts: 1287 | Posted: 9:49 PM on March 23, 2007 | IP
    
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