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tsmith2771

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If any of you have seen on the news lately there have been many protesters outside the Augusta National golf club protesting because they won't allow black or women members.  This is a complete and total private club whoes members are mostly worth 200 million and above.  If you don't know Augusta is where the Masters golf tournament is held and its probably the biggest in the world.  They are trying to get Tiger Woods to refuse to play.  What do you all think.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 05:43 AM on December 10, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i think the protesters are right. we are living in the 21st century right now, there is absolutly no reason to discriminate against race or gender


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 09:30 AM on December 10, 2002 | IP
meditate

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ok I'm not racist or sexist, but ITS A PRIVATE CLUB ! are there women in the Mason's ? No. Are there Elks in the Moose Lodge ? No. Is Satan Allowed in Heaven? No. Thats technically decrimination too. BUT THOSE ARE PRIVATE. I wouldn't be allowed in that Augusta club either and I am white. There are plenty of country Clubs blacks and women are allowed to join. Shiloh Falls Golf and Country Club, in pickwick Tennessee doesn't descriminate if  you can come up with the money for the membership. and no, I don't think Tiger should sit it out.


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Meditate
 


Posts: 33 | Posted: 12:12 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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You think the protestors are right?  It is a private club and they can do whatever they want when it comes to membership



-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 8:20 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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Hey im coming over to your house today and if you dont let me in it is bc you are discriminating against white male southern rednecks. I dont care if you say "i dont know you go away you stranger" i will demand to be let in or else i will accuse you of discriminating.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 8:54 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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excuse me for wanting people to have equal opportunity


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 10:30 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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they have equal oppurtunity to go start there own club. No one is stopping them from going out and creating a golf course and start a club.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 11:23 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
thistownwilleatu

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but they dont have the opportunity to golf at that particular club solely because of the color of their skin or their gender


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"The greatest evil is not done in those sordid dens of evil that Dickens loved to paint ... but is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried and minuted) in clear, carpeted, warmed, well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voices." - Thomas Merton

"I thank my God for every remembrance of you." - Paul
 


Posts: 341 | Posted: 03:25 AM on December 11, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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So.  It is a complete and total private club.  They should be able to let in who they want and not let in who they don't want.  You also have to remember this is basically in the heart of the deep south.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 03:37 AM on December 11, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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it really has nothing to do with race or sex. I could not join the club and im white. No one on this forum could. To get in you have to have a friend or family member already in it and you have to have more than 200 million dollars. Im serious its not discriminating against anyone by race or sex. Tiger Woods has played there and so has the WPGA so you cant say that they wont let any one play there, they just wont let you join there club and they shouldnt have to, it is like a stranger coming to your door (who is black) and saying "let me in or else you are discriminating" of course you would say "i dont know you now leave" and you have every right.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 04:11 AM on December 11, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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no its more like this:  i invite everyone to the neighborhood to my party at my house and everyone can come no matter who they are, but when a black person shows up at the door i say "i'm sorry but i cant let you in because you're black. i'm really not racist. i just dont like black people in my house."


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 12:49 PM on December 11, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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No that is nothing like what is going on, your neighboorhood is public, augusta is private.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 1:15 PM on December 11, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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also augusta isnt inviting anyone over..it is for family members and friends..if you didnt have any black friends are you just going to invite some black people you dont know just so that you have black people there...no you would only invite your friends....amd to be a member of Augusta you have to fit into its rules...such as having at least 2oo million dollars...yeah that is a real rule.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 3:59 PM on December 11, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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tsmith, i never said my neighborhood wasnt public...but my house is private


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 7:28 PM on December 11, 2002 | IP
meditate

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u ever hear of a black guy yelling descrimination cuz he wasn't allowed to join the KKK ? this augusta deal is ridiculous. key word: PRIVATE. everyone say it with me now. PRIVATE. good.


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Meditate
 


Posts: 33 | Posted: 11:53 PM on December 11, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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PRIVATE


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 12:35 AM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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ok so are you saying that if McDonalds wanted to have separate water fountains for "colored" and "white" then it is ok because it is private property? i thought this was the 21st century. when will people learn that race does not matter?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 03:35 AM on December 12, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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no bc mcdonalds is a buisiness that is public and it is regulated by interstate commerce....augusta national isnt.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 03:48 AM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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ok then, is it fine if a private school has separate water fountains for "colored" people and white people?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 04:38 AM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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and since when is mcdonalds a government corporation?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 04:49 AM on December 12, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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are you totally lacking in common sense....no one said mcdonalds is a government buisiness...and yes if a private school wanted seperate water fountains it could have them...do you not under stand freedom....


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 2:25 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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do you not understand that race should not matter?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 2:40 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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race should not matter to government but individual citixzens can think whatever they want to and a government cant tell them what to think...augusta national has no women in it, so what Alexanderthegrreat doesnt go out with women, is he discriminating bc he is gay and only goes out with guys...no it is his personal life...do any blacks live in your parents house...if not you need to let some move in(even if you dont know them) or else you are racist. No seriously you are really an idiot...i try not to call names but you make no sense on any topic...you dont know the difference between private and public...you dont know history...you dont know about the topic on hand...you dont know anything abpout the constitution...you dont know any thing about guns...you are the definition of a useful idiot. Sorry to call names but it is true you have no logic or reasoning behind anything you say...you think everything without a black person is racist, and you cant see the difference batween private and public. You dont realize that you nor I could join Augusta national bc we dont know any memebers and are not related to any memebers, and if we where neither one of us have the 200 million dollar standard that you must have to be a memeber of this richmans club, also neither one of us have the one million dollar entry fee...so they are discriminating against us bc we can not join...it doesnt matter about race or sex it is all about who you know and how much money you have....get over it...and get real


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 2:53 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i love you too


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:19 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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of course we wouldnt be allowed to be members at that club because we suck at golf. but there are plenty of excellent black and women golfers. you are truly an asshole. you are so obsessed with race. why dont you learn how to look beyond the color of a person's skin? why does it matter whether a person is black, white, yellow, red, green, blue, or whatever. a person should be judged by their actions (or in this case, judged by their golf playing ability). ya know, there are other people on this planet besides rich white males. i hope you realize that. or maybe your stupidity and ignorance is blinding you to that fact.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:25 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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secondly, i am a history major and i know ALOT more history then you could ever hope to know. so dont go around saying that i dont know history, cuz i can kick your butt in history any day.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:26 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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thirdly, are you trying to tell me that private organizations do not have to comply to any laws? so a private organization can do whatever they want?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:28 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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The bottom line is that they are a private club and if they don't want women or blacks in their club they don't have to let them in.  One reporter said they don't have to fear the loss of corporate sponsership, its not like these men are millionaires, they are billionaires.  It is a private club and you have to be invited to be there.  


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 9:28 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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thank you for not calling me an idiot like your friend tends to always do


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 9:39 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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And another thing, why would you want to be somewhere were it is evident that you are strongly not wanted?  It don't care if it wasn't the second best golf course in america, I would join if I wasn't wanted.  Of the top of your alls heads, anyone know the number one golf course?


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 9:42 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
thistownwilleatu

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Pebble Beach?


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"The greatest evil is not done in those sordid dens of evil that Dickens loved to paint ... but is conceived and ordered (moved, seconded, carried and minuted) in clear, carpeted, warmed, well-lighted offices, by quiet men with white collars and cut fingernails and smooth-shaven cheeks who do not need to raise their voices." - Thomas Merton

"I thank my God for every remembrance of you." - Paul
 


Posts: 341 | Posted: 10:39 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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Close, thats fourth.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 11:52 PM on December 12, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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madbilly can shove it


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 01:11 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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First you condem people for going personal, and now look at you.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 03:26 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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he asked for it


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 03:28 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i have every right to trash madbilly after all that garbage he said about me


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 03:29 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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yeah..you really trashed me.whoaess me what ever am i going to do...you dont even know what a useful idiot is do you...i didnt insult you just arent familiar with the term useful idiot....thats not my fault and to have a major in history then why dont you even know why the french dont like americans in that history thread....lookup the meaning of useful idiot and see if you are still offended....most likely you will feel dumb but thats not my problem.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 04:21 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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oh i am so sorry. i can i possibly forget. the term "useful idiot" is a great compliment. i'm sure everyone's goal in life is to be a "useful idiot". i am so lucky that i became one so early in life. and i apologize that i am not as amazingly smart and intelligent as yourself, i'm only a teenager. i wish i was as smart and intelligent as madbilly.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 10:24 AM on December 13, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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Please just shut up and let it go.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 2:04 PM on December 13, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i'm just curious how "useful idiot" is a compliment


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:07 PM on December 13, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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You can sit up there on your high moral ground and look down on all of us but when you start attacking people you aren't so moral are you?


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 4:10 PM on December 13, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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who started attacking first?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 4:25 PM on December 13, 2002 | IP
Cool-Hand-Dave

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now, now boys.  are we gonna have to send you all into time-out, or pull out measuring tapes and wangers.  


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Cool Hand Dave
 


Posts: 134 | Posted: 5:33 PM on December 13, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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"useful idiot" is a term that refers to any one that has a different point of view that cannot be changed through pesuasion. It is a term that is common in Georgia. I have even heard politicians running for GA offices use the term. It isnt saying that you are an idiot...its like if someone said to you "your acting like a fool"...it isnt calling you a fool but rather implying that you are currently doing something not to smart. The term was coined during segregation by the republicans that where fighting against segregation and they would refer to the Democrats as useful idiots bc at that time the dems. where trying to label african americans as inferior and trying to keep segregation.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 02:24 AM on December 14, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i think we both have very strong and different points of view that would be hard for anyone to persuade. so in that sense, we are both "useful idiots"


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 10:28 AM on December 14, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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yes..i would be a useful idiot to you and visa versa


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 4:01 PM on December 14, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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agreed. now lets stop talking about this nonsense


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 12:24 AM on December 15, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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wow. i'm looking back at this debate a month later and all i can do is laugh


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 02:26 AM on January 19, 2003 | IP
dsadevil

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Both sides are right. Augusta has the right to allow in whomever it wants, its a private club. The protesters have the right to say that this is sexist (its about not letting women in) and  thus Tiger Woods and other people shouldn't play. Both sides are in the right. I'd argue the same way the more reasonable protesters are arguing. They CAN discriminate if they want, but if they do they will have folk like me yelling at 'em constantly.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 11:27 AM on January 19, 2003 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i was laughing at the argument and namecalling between me and madbilly. madbilly was a jerk. i'm glad he doesnt post anymore.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 6:30 PM on January 19, 2003 | IP
    
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