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Can Evolution and Religion Coexist ?

http://www.youdebate.com/DEBATES/creation_evolution_religion.HTM


(Edited by admin 4/30/2002 at 3:53 PM.)


(Edited by admin 4/30/2002 at 3:53 PM.)
 


Posts: 31 | Posted: 3:22 PM on April 30, 2002 | IP
holsbeke

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No evolution cannot exist in harmony with the Christian religion. It defies the creation that is discribed in Genesis and the ability of God to do the impossible. It is man trying to adapt his meager abilities to disprove what God has said. Go stand at the edge of the Grand Canyon and try to picture that just happening by adding millions of years together. Look at  the stars and the sun and the sea and the fact that there is a balance beyond our reasoning that makes it all work.


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Patricia Holsbeke
 


Posts: 7 | Posted: 8:57 PM on June 22, 2002 | IP
Xerozero

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As a Christian, computer programmer, and evolutionist, I herby state these facts.

A computer such as the one we are all using, has the possibility of getting infected with computer viruses, both of which are creations of man.

When data is corrupt it is still data, unlikely usable, but still data.  Each byte still contains a value between 0 and 255, however, in some random unexpected, but usually logical, way, it is changed (i.e. the corrupt data was caused by a programming error or bug that modifies data in ways that are not obvious to all).

Any program, virus, or data in the computer’s primary and/ or secondary storage (ram, hard disk, floppy disk, etc.) may be corrupted through various means. There is chance that an individual, any, or all bytes of data within a computer will become corrupt.

Some viruses are very tiny in relation to other data/programs. Lets say that we have an executable virus that is only 128 bytes.  So, given 128 numbers with a value between 0 and 255, we have 256 raised to the power of 128 possibilities for the data that can exist in 128 bytes. With those possibilities, many different viruses, and, of course, other programs/data, can exist. The number of possibilities is greater then the scientifically agreed upon estimated number of atoms in the universe (10^80 which is 1 with 80 zeros behind it).

Any data and/or virus can be changed, modified, or corrupted into a new virus, or any other data, which can be harder to detect then others with a virus scanner (because it is newer then the scanner at the time of creation, so the scanner does not know the pattern of the virus.)

So, it is fact that a computer virus can be created, or evolve, purely on the basis of evolution. It is also fact that the odds of a virus being created, or evolving, in a single computer is extremely low, the probability of it happening increases with the number of computers in use, and the number of year that pass.

Based on the above facts, and the fact that I believe that God created the laws of the universe, including evolution, yes, evolution and religion can coexist, and they do!

The evolution that I described is indifferent to all other forms of evolution.

Who said God cannot create laws for his atoms that allow evolution and the big bang to exist and not have the ability make adjustment?

In my opinion God created every thing including evolution (and the laws of every wave).


Steven M. Cheatham (C) 2000 – All rights reserved.

 


Posts: 4 | Posted: 03:45 AM on August 10, 2002 | IP
Lost

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Of course the two can co-exist!

By creating the world, God just set the ball rolling for evolution. God gave something for evolution to work with, and therefore you could say that, indeed, he DID create evolution.

The two essencially need each other. God/religion gave evolution life to work with, and evolution ensured for the religion that life would survive.
 


Posts: 8 | Posted: 6:36 PM on August 15, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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besides, the whole "7 days then equals 7 days now" makes no sense. How do we measure a day? 1 earth rotation around the sun. When was the sun created? the fourth "day." So what are the other 3 days? Obviously a day doesn't = a modern day, but rather is a phase of time, maybe millions of years? So I think they can coexist, not saying I think they do, just that they can.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 01:12 AM on August 18, 2002 | IP
Jigokusabre

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The basic problem with inserting millions and billions of years into the genisis account is that it exagerates the problems within the Genisis creation story.

The so called "Gap Theory" would contend that light was created millions or billions of years beofre sources of light, the earth was created millions or billions of years before the other stars or planets.  Grass and trees existed for millions or billions of years before the sun and moon, etc, etc, etc.




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Posts: 30 | Posted: 8:35 PM on August 19, 2002 | IP
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I believe that religion and evolution cannot co-exist.  If you are a Christian and a follower of Jesus Christ than you believe everything in the Bible.  The Bible states clearly that God created heaven and earth and everything on both.  While the Bible states that God created everything in one week it also states in 2 Peter 3:8 "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."


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R. Faith Heck
 


Posts: 1 | Posted: 12:33 PM on August 28, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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That quote would seem to validate the possibilty of evolution being compatable w/ religion. But I'm Jewish, and I don't believe every word the Tanach (old testament) says. Its that wonderful thing I learned in english class called the Extended Metaphor, and I think it is used quite liberally in the bible. And why shouldn't it? Every other writer seems to use it. Why does God have to be perfectly straightforward all the time. The lord does, after all, work in mysterious ways.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 2:51 PM on August 28, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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well....take the dinosaurs, when they were first discovered, the bible never covered anything at all about dinosaurs and extinction, so therefor priests decided that they did not exist, eventually the scientists who discovered them persuaded them to re-write the genesis, but either way... it proves the bible was not written correctly or even by fact-to-fact stories so i view the bible as an unreliable source.
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 7:06 PM on September 2, 2002 | IP
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Well if you believed the bible 100 percent you would be jewish, you can't take the bible for word, you take it for context


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 9:50 PM on September 8, 2002 | IP
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actually, jewish people often take the bible alot LESS literally than christians. Its our inclination towards argument I suppose, but we just HATE any definitive standard we have to live by. It just bothers us.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 10:44 PM on September 8, 2002 | IP
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I didn't mean jewish people that read the bible, I meant christians.  Any christians who believe in the bible 100 percent then you are a walking contradiction.  If you believe in the bible 100 percent then you would be jewish.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 01:08 AM on September 9, 2002 | IP
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ok, i suppose that's true. But being jewish doesn't mean u believe the bible word for word (I think we are actually in agreement for once!)


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 2:46 PM on September 9, 2002 | IP
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Besides the first five books of the bible, the jewish religion has nothing to do with the bible so why would a jewish person believe it 100 percent, word for word.  But I will state this again, ANYONE WHO BELIEVES IN THE BIBLE 100 PERCENT WOULD BE JEWISH AND YOU ARE A WALKING CONTRADICTION.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 5:17 PM on September 9, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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Wait, was all this "100% stuff" directed at ME? Because I am a) Jewish, and b) dont believe the bible (or at least the Tanach part of it, which expands past the torah and into the prophets and writings sections) word for word. I dont believe the "new" testament at all. Where is the contradiction in that?


-------
"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 5:23 PM on September 9, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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Let me spell this out for you a little clearer.  Any christian who believes in the bible, the king james version, 100 persent would be a walking contradiction.  That was not directed at anyone jewish and especially not to you.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 7:30 PM on September 9, 2002 | IP
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ok, that's what i thought you meant originally. The "you" in "you are a walking contradiction" threw me.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 8:16 PM on September 9, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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actually the bible is based off of the jewish bible which is called the torah, all it really is, is plagurism with a few added things
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 07:06 AM on September 10, 2002 | IP
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No, actually the first five books of the bible are the torag\h, Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, dedoronomy and numbers.  Some of those I am sure are spelled wrong.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 1:07 PM on September 10, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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lol...funny, the bible is like i said i copy of the torah...study it
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 6:57 PM on September 10, 2002 | IP
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You said based which makes it sound like they took the torah and changed the words.  The first five books are the torah, so the bible is an add on of the torah, not a copy.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 7:53 PM on September 10, 2002 | IP
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some thoughts i have concerning this evolution stuff.  one on the hunched over shape of human bones.  if you research Jewish history you will find that people lived over nine hundred years! now look at a person who is eighty, he dosent stand up like he used to because grvity has taken its toll on his body so think about how a person nine hundred years old would walk or look like if you dug up their graves.  they would look similiar to the bones found among "early man" or whatever.  also i would suggest reading a book called scienctific creationism.  
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:18 PM on September 14, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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the bible is the Torah cept for chnge of words an ex tra part to it and new stories...really u could consider it religion evolution...how ironic
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 9:26 PM on September 15, 2002 | IP
Exxoss

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My belief is...No.   Creationism and religion is a clash of ideas.  In the bible, it states (not exactly quoted) "Thou shalt not believe in that which the holy bible has stated untrue."  "That which is of the study of such things as stars representing gods.  Thou shalt not believe in the study of things such as science."  This is basically saying science is wrong.  God is right.  In my mind, neither is correct.  (I'm Wiccan.)  Now then, in the case of scientists believe in god as well, people can believe that, but most christians, 45%, say that there cannot exist a coexistant belief of creationism and religion.  Science also totally disproves god, saying that the big bang happened, and adam and eve could have happened only if they were cavemen.  Christianity says no science.  See my point?  Therefore, creationism and religion cannot coexist without creating a dtrimental enviroment for those are against one or the other.[color=green][color=lime] [/color] [/color]


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 4:51 PM on September 20, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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actually they can co-exist... they r both theories that have yet to be proven...
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 10:26 PM on September 20, 2002 | IP
kuanteen

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when God created, he said it was, "good." when he finished he said it was "very good." how can a world that has been through billions of years of death and struggle, of survival of the fittest, be good? also, evolution is religion, the belief in NO god, as it is, it requires faith to believe both sides of this debate. [random] Faith is the substance of fossils hoped for, of links unseen.


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AMD Athlon XP 1600+ | Gigabyte GA-7VTXH+ | Samsung 256 Mb. DDR-SDRAM | Seagate 40 Gb. 7200 rpm ATA100 | nVidia GeForce 2 MX400 64 mb | LG 24x10x40 CD-RW 8 Mb. Buffer | ASUS 52x CD-ROM | NEC Zip100 | US Robotics 56 K Ext. Modem | MAG 15'' Trinitron
 


Posts: 7 | Posted: 10:57 PM on September 20, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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OK, once again, "Believing" in the theory of evolution isn't the same as being an athiest. I am an evolutionist who believes in God. Stop equating the two.


-------
"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 11:35 PM on September 20, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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I believe in evolution and the big bang theory, but something had to put that in motion, thats where god came in.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 3:21 PM on September 21, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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notch up another rare agreement between Tsmith and DSA.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 5:12 PM on September 21, 2002 | IP
Xenjael

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um....this is just a theory...but the universe was created in a cosmic soap tht\at has no beginning or end...its like where cell came from the bone...the bone came from person the person came from the carrier...so really if u were to just have the cell(our universe) it would have no knowledge of what came b4 it thats like us we just dont no... probably never will,and plus, death is good when u lookat it from a certian point of u, because if god said it was good and then very good, then to his own means it must be good...so since were just little pathetic humans comapered to his awesome might we cant comprehend anything about "ot" to the degree above the fact that "it" is all powerful...but to disprove what i just said....have ne of ur prayers been answered, and i dont want to no bout ne thing like what u wishewd for came true i want u to actually have been spoken too, and that means u guewsts too and u dsadevil
 


Posts: 83 | Posted: 9:46 PM on September 21, 2002 | IP
Exxoss

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They are a clash of ideas; one being science, one being religion, both contradicting eachother and themselves!


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 09:01 AM on September 25, 2002 | IP
kuanteen

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evolution is also a religion, as in athiestic evolution, it is not science, science is in the present, and within the limits of the scientific method


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AMD Athlon XP 1600+ | Gigabyte GA-7VTXH+ | Samsung 256 Mb. DDR-SDRAM | Seagate 40 Gb. 7200 rpm ATA100 | nVidia GeForce 2 MX400 64 mb | LG 24x10x40 CD-RW 8 Mb. Buffer | ASUS 52x CD-ROM | NEC Zip100 | US Robotics 56 K Ext. Modem | MAG 15'' Trinitron
 


Posts: 7 | Posted: 10:56 AM on September 26, 2002 | IP
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Atheism is not a religion, but the belief that all religions are incorrect!  idiot...Atheism isnt always belief in science n e way.  Thats just caleld belief in science!


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 2:05 PM on September 26, 2002 | IP
kuanteen

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if you define a religion as a belief that obviously it is...   now, evolution is not science, and if it is a belief, then that is also a religion of sorts...

mung maeng ngo.


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AMD Athlon XP 1600+ | Gigabyte GA-7VTXH+ | Samsung 256 Mb. DDR-SDRAM | Seagate 40 Gb. 7200 rpm ATA100 | nVidia GeForce 2 MX400 64 mb | LG 24x10x40 CD-RW 8 Mb. Buffer | ASUS 52x CD-ROM | NEC Zip100 | US Robotics 56 K Ext. Modem | MAG 15'' Trinitron
 


Posts: 7 | Posted: 10:54 AM on September 27, 2002 | IP
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But in science, there are no beliefs.  There are facts and opinions.  Everything must be exact.  Thats why science believers are always atheist, no religion.


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 4:55 PM on September 27, 2002 | IP
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Not nessacarily. You don't have to believe your own Holy book is right (ex. Torah, Bible, Koran, etc.), you can still believe in a higher power and be a scientist.
 


Posts: 30 | Posted: 5:06 PM on September 27, 2002 | IP
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Yes, but you still have to be a evolution bellever to be a true scientist, otherwise you are \religious.


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 7:45 PM on September 27, 2002 | IP
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not at all, you can believe in a 3rd theory outside of evolution or creationism and call yourself a scientist. Evolution hasn't been proven, therefore it is totally legitimate to believe another theory. If you can back it up (which creationists can't).


-------
"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 2:47 PM on September 30, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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I believe in evolution but something had to get the ball rolling, thats where god came in.  Now, am I an athesist for believing in science or religious for believing in god, please exxoss tell me.


-------
"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 02:05 AM on October 8, 2002 | IP
Sakata

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I always found this debate amusing, when evolutionist finally realize that this big organic soup couldnt have just magicly appeared, they realize there is a God.  But still so stuck to their false belifs in evolution, and not willing to accept defeat, they came up with "Well hey! maybe God created everything, then evolution did the rest" This is mearly a last ditch effort by evolutionists too stubborn to admit they're wrong, that has no facts to back it up.


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No time for mediocrity.

People call me a Bible-Thumping reactionist ...and I'm proud to bear the name.
 


Posts: 293 | Posted: 11:36 PM on October 8, 2002 | IP
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"They are a clash of ideas; one being science, one being religion, both contradicting eachother and themselves!"

     -Exxoss




I dare you to find me one contradiction in the bible that I cant dissprove Exxoss, I dare you.



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No time for mediocrity.

People call me a Bible-Thumping reactionist ...and I'm proud to bear the name.
 


Posts: 293 | Posted: 11:54 PM on October 8, 2002 | IP
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Ooh, ooh! can i try? How about the theme of "God is good and just." vs. "Let's slaughter all of Job's son's to win an ego match with the Sepharim"?


-------
"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 11:59 PM on October 8, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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and as to your previous post, who said this "soup" couldn't have formed by itself? it is, in essence, a bunch of chemicals. At some point, in the vast infinitness of the universe, eventually the magic combo should come up. God doesn't have to play a role at all.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 12:01 AM on October 9, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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dsadevil you make a good point, but where did all those chemicals come from first, who or what put those chemicals there?


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 12:37 AM on October 9, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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we don't know do we? but its no different to say "they always existed, that's what the universe is" than to say "they were created by a God, who always existed w/out being created." At some point SOMETHING had to exist w/out being created by something else. The only question is how far back we stretch before we decide "this" is what was always there, everything is based off this. The difference between that stopping point being God and a bunch of molecules is that we at least know the molecules were there at somepoint, while we cant say the same for God.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 1:27 PM on October 9, 2002 | IP
Sakata

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Ego match with satan? You might want to double check that, it was satan who killed all of Job's decendants. But I understand where you are coming from.  Many people have problems when they see God comanding to "save alive nothing that breatheth", the concept as a whole is a difficult question- not so much as it pertains to the adults, but to children.  Such was also the case with Sodom and Gomorrah (Genesis 13:13) When those cities were destroyed by fire (the evidence of which can still be seen in that part of Israel today), that babies and children were destroyed also.  However, that God did not wish to destroy these people is clear from His statement to Abraham when promising him the land of Canaan:  "The iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full"(Genesis 15:16).  This tells us that God did not at that time consider that wickedness of these people great enough to warrant their extermination.  With that understanding, perhaps we can trust God that when He did destroy them, including even their children, it was the only way to cleanse that horribly defiled land.
   Let us not forget that God was longsuffering for more than 400 years as the wickedness of these people grew ever greater.  At last He had to destroy them for the good of the remainder of the human race.  We may be certain that this was done reluctantly.  God assures us:

"As I live, saith the Lord God,  I have no pleasure in the daeth of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways, for why will ye die, O house of Israel?" - Ezekiel 33:11


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No time for mediocrity.

People call me a Bible-Thumping reactionist ...and I'm proud to bear the name.
 


Posts: 293 | Posted: 7:22 PM on October 9, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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that's nice. im sure all those kids who went up in smoke are all a-ok with it because God was troubled by his mass extermination. But as for your assertation that it was satan that killed Job's children, that may be technically true, but God gave him the green light, and did that because the sepharim goaded him into an ego match. Job 1:8-12  "And the lord said 'hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and upright man, one that feareth God and escheweth evil?'The adversary [sepharim] answered, 'oth Job fear God for nought? Hast not thou made a hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side. put forth thine hand and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee.' God said 'behold, all he hath is in thy power, only upon himself do not put forth thy hand'"
how big of God. "oh yeah? go ahead, try anything you want on my loyal servant! bring it punk!" He's so mature.
etc. etc., everyone dies, and God can only say to sepharim "ha, you took your best shot and he STILL worships me!"
seems pretty clear to me...God can be an quite reckless with his power at times.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 10:23 PM on October 9, 2002 | IP
Sakata

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and then God, give him 8 more children and doubled or timed by ten everythign that was taken away, so in the end, Job is closer to God, his children are finally home. and the kids that are "up in smoke" are in eternal bliss with they're creator, if anything it was God showing mearcy on them before they grew up in a world where they stood hardly a chance of not being corrupted.


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No time for mediocrity.

People call me a Bible-Thumping reactionist ...and I'm proud to bear the name.
 


Posts: 293 | Posted: 12:46 AM on October 10, 2002 | IP
dsadevil

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oh that's a solid argument. so if i went around murdering babies, i'd be doing them a favor, because now they're assured a spot in heaven? Would that justify it for me? Hardly. I think those kids would have liked a choice, rather than be caught in the middle of yes, i'll again refer to it as an ego match. It wasn't right.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 4:37 PM on October 10, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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I have already posted this in this thread 4800 times, if you believe in the bible 100 percent then you are a walking contradiction and should be jewish.  Bottom line.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 10:29 PM on October 10, 2002 | IP
    
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