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Is man's effect on the ozone insignificant?

http://www.youdebate.com/DEBATES/rush_volcanoe_ozone.HTM

(Edited by admin 10/8/2002 at 6:47 PM).
 


Posts: 31 | Posted: 11:17 AM on May 1, 2002 | IP
Exxoss

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Yes.  THe ozone rapidly 'heals' itself, making it insignificant.  However, other factors such as natural gas pollution increase, which could cause a problem in 2050.


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 10:22 AM on September 25, 2002 | IP
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If we had not stopped the use of CFC in the 80s, we could already be dead!

The scientist who found the ozone hole received a Nobel Prize.. Maybe that guy saved us all..

The problem is that this scientist predicts that there will be an ozone hole in the arctic by 2020 that will be as big as the one over antartica now.

This can have harmful consequences on arctic wildlife, especially on phytoplankton.

There is much more phytoplankton at the highest latitudes than at the equator ( by a factor of 10). But phytoplankton is sensitive to UV. The ozone hole may kill the phytoplankton and cause starvation.

Another big issue is the effect of phytoplankton on global warming. If phytoplankton production is reduced by 10%, the carbon balance of the planet is reduced by 5%, which would be enough to make the Earth become a source of greenhouse gases.

Phytoplankton reduction is regarded by climate experts as a positive feedback factor.

By the way, a study done in 2001 has shown that the phytoplankton productivity of the north pacific has dropped 15% in the last 20 years.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:44 AM on October 22, 2002 | IP
Exxoss

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ScArY...  But the ozone heals itself repeatedly, and the only problems we will face are in 2050 due to this new 'healing' research.


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

-Exxoss
 


Posts: 438 | Posted: 7:11 PM on November 1, 2002 | IP
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The "ozone hole"?  Are you kidding?  There is no actual hole, just a thinning(two of them)  This thinning could appear serious, until you consider the following:
1. No one lives at the South Pole, or the North Pole, so any UV rays that got through there couldn't cause much of a problem for us.
2. This thinning is a thinning of about 5%.  Scary, especially when you know that the normal variance for the ozone layer from season to season is about 50%!

CFC's are the most efficient refrigerant known to man, it's a great medical sterilizer, and it does an excellent job of firefighting!  Forget the economic troubles we'll be facing when we run out of CFC's, (as if we aren't facing enough now!) and think about all the people who will die as a result of this anti-CFC attitude!

Exxos, I've read quite a few of your posts, and I disagree with you most of the time, but you made a comment on this issue with which I agree 100%: "the only problems we will face are in 2050 due to this new 'healing' research."

I say give us our CFC's back and forget the non-problem sitting over the South Pole!


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David B. Thompson


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Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 5:32 PM on December 24, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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david, you are a Christian correct? well why dont you have any respect for God's creation? you have a very arrogant attitude when it comes to the environment. there may not be a human population in the north or south pole, but there is abundant wildlife. i believe all Christians should be environmentalists...why destroy what God has created?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 12:44 AM on December 26, 2002 | IP
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Fallingup, yes, I am a Christian and as such, I do care about God's creation.  Apparently, you didn't read the rest of my post.  I said:
"This thinning is a thinning of about 5%.  Scary, especially when you know that the normal variance for the ozone layer from season to season is about 50%!"
So there is no problem with the ozone layer!  Any life that does exist at the poles is perfectly safe (albeit a little chilly!).

No, Christians should not join the modern enviromentalist movement!  Why?  Because enviromentalists promote their political agenda with "scientific" hoaxes!  The "ozone hole", "global warming", and the "population explosion" are three of the biggest hoaxes that have ever claimed "scientific backing"!  Environmentalists use them all the time, warning people that if they don't "take action", (usually electing a particular candidate or passing a particular piece of legislation) then the planet is doomed.  Notice that the "answers" they provide always (to my knowledge) limit our freedom, take our money, and\or murder defenceless people!  Also notice who has these "answers"; liberals.  So, in the end, the "ozone hole" is just another hoax used to scare people into supporting liberalism, which is now the greatest threat to our freedom!

Let's start caring more for God's creation than a political (liberal) agenda!


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David B. Thompson


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Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 10:27 PM on December 26, 2002 | IP
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well, i personally dont find anything wrong with liberals since i am one and since Jesus was too. but thats beside the point. global warming and the ozone layer are not the only issues!! what about the cutting down of the rainforests in south america? or the destruction of animal habitats? those are very important issues as well


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 02:06 AM on December 27, 2002 | IP
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Obviously!  Your liberalism drips from every word!
Jesus was a liberal?  That's blasphemy!  It is off the point, so if you want to debate this issue, start a new forum and drop me a personal message.  I'll be there on horseback, lance in rest!  Consider yourself challenged!
I am well aware that there are other issues, the ones I listed are merely some of the biggest ones.  There are different problems with some of the other stuff they use as well.  Sure, there has to be a balance, but they go to the liberal extreme!  Whenever they are actually right about what's going on, they overreact, which often results in worshipping and serving "the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed forever.  Amen."  (Romans 1:24b)
Sure these other issues have some importance, and yes, we should be good stewards of God's creation, but we have to keep in balance, something for which liberals are definitely not known!  (They're not the only ones, but they're the object of this particular discussion)
But all of that is off the point.  The fact is that the so-called "ozone hole", is a non-problem, a piece of liberal propaganda!


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David B. Thompson


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Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 2:26 PM on December 27, 2002 | IP
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About liberalism: There is definitely something wrong with it!  It advocates murder, (abortion, infantacide, assisted suicide, etc.) and it's ultimate goal is to subject us, the American people, to tyranny by taking our money, our freedom, and our ability to think!  Liberalism is, at its core, the same as Nazism!  I believe that most people who call themselves "liberals" are unaware of this, and have simply been decieved into following the agenda to its lair.  Those "at the top", however, know what they're doing.  They want power and control, and that takes some doing in a nation that was once as free as ours was at its founding!

A big part of the liberal agenda includes removing God from America.  This is extremely dangerous!  Thomas Jefferson (yes, the Thomas Jefferson) asked "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure if we have lost the only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath?"

No, they can't.
That's my problem with liberalism.

God bless America!!!


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David B. Thompson


God
Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 3:06 PM on December 27, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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oh dont you worry, i'll start a separate debate on whether Jesus was liberal or not.
you are very ignorant when it comes to history. contrary to what you think, Hitler and the Nazis were very far right-wing. Hitler hated socialists with a passion!!! secondly, i am different from most liberals on one main issue: abortion. i am against all death: abortion and capital punishment.
liberals want to take our money?? HAHAHA!!! what about your precious capitalism???? it takes money from the poor. socialism GIVES money and programs to the poor.
hate to break the news to you, but Thomas Jefferson was NOT a christian, he was a deist...

well there is my response to your conservative lies. have a wonderful day!!


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 11:18 PM on December 27, 2002 | IP
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dude i thought Hitler was a socialist bc i thought NAZI stoud for national socialist workers party....maybe i was wrong...i know hitler hated communism but i thought he was a socialist.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 04:25 AM on December 28, 2002 | IP
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There are more evils than socialism you know!  Hitler stood for tyranny!  He was hardly right-wing!  (At least in the modern American sense of the word)  Sure, Hitler hated the communist party!  He also hated Christians and Jews!  (And yes, I am well aware that he claimed to be a Catholic)

Great!  I'm glad to hear that you're against abortion!  Capital punishment's another issue-one we're not going to get into here!

Correction, Capitalism allows the poor to work hard and become wealthy, liberalism (or socialism\communism) makes wealthy and hardworking people poor via taxes, then works to keep them poor!  But that's another debate as well!

Wait a minute!  I never said that Thomas Jefferson was a Christian!  I only cited a confirmed quote from his writings!  Although what Thomas Jefferson believed is also another debate, (one that I might join if I get the time) let's look at reality: do you know the colonial meaning of the word "deist"?  Obviously not!  Back then, a "deist" was someone who believed in and worshipped God!  I could say more, and I could quote Jefferson himself on the issue, but again, that's another debate!

So much for "conservative lies"!  You made a bunch of false, unsupported claims!

(Edited by David_B_Thompson 12/28/2002 at 06:44 AM).


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David B. Thompson


God
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America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 06:42 AM on December 28, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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yes madbilly, you are correct when you say that NAZI stood for national socialist workers party. but Hitler was hardly a socialist!!! nazi germany had no federal programs or anything to help the poor. hitler was conservative. he wanted to keep german tradition and wanted to "cleanse" the country from foreigners (starting with the Jews). this is an ultra-conservative idea. you can see some of this in america today when right-wing politicians speak out against immigration and make racist remarks about minorities.

Correction, Capitalism lets the richest 2% have most of the money. Socialism allows everyone to have their fair share.

You do not know the meaning of deist back in the colonial era. Most scholars during the Enlightenment were deists. a deist was one who believed in a God, but did not believe that we could have a personal relationship with Him. they believed that after God created the world, He stayed out of human affairs.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 11:19 AM on December 28, 2002 | IP
David_B_Thompson

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Just because a country has no welfare programs doesn't mean that the leader is conservative!  Hitler was a murderer, not a conservative!  Traditionally, government murderers are liberals.

Hitler wanted to cleanse Germany (and other countries) of Jews alright!  But why?  Because he believed that they, along with a few other "races", were sub-human!  He believed that they were under-evolved!  Evolution, may I remind you, is a liberal teaching!  Conservatives (most of them) "hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."
Conservativism is inherently anti-racist!

Correction on conservative policy: conservatives do not oppose legal immigration!  We invite everyone to come and taste freedom!  Tell me where, when, and why we have ever opposed legal immigration!

Racist remarks?  That's it!  You're going to have to start proving your accusations!  I'm not going to waste my time proving your empty accusations wrong until you start bringing out some evidence!

Capitalism rewards hard workers with wealth, while punishing the lazy!  Socialism causes poverty and encourages mass laziness by removing all incentives to productive industry!  (Except maybe military threats!)  Sure, there are occasional instances where someone is actually unable to work, but that's where Churches and charity come in!  They were doing just fine in America until the government took over!

If that is the actual meaning of the word "deist", then why did Thomas Jefferson, who claimed to be one, say "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure if we have lost the only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath?"  If he thought that God had created the world and then "stood back", then why would he even mention the possibility of wrath?  Displaying wrath is getting a little involved for a policy of uninvolvement isn't it?  Thomas Jefferson said quite a bit more, by the way, about his beliefs, but you'll never hear that as long as liberals are in control of schools, Hollywood, and the media!

But, again, we're straying from the issue of the so-called "ozone hole".  Can we agree that the "ozone hole" is a non-problem deserving no action at all?  Such a non-problem, in fact, that we push to restart production of those wonderful, non-toxic CFCs?  I think it's time that we arrived at such a conclusion, unless anyone else has any more relevant arguments!


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David B. Thompson


God
Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 4:04 PM on December 28, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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no we cannot agree that the ozone-problem is really no problem at all. i do not believe that we should stand back and allow the north and south pole to melt.

are you really so ignorant that i have to point out to you conservatives that have made racist remarks? ever heard of Trent Lott, Jesse Helms, or Strom Thurmond???

correction on conservative policy: conservatives oppose an increase in the amount of immigrants allowed in the country.

capitalism allows multi-millionares and multi-billionares to get even richer. why do these already priveledged people need more money when there are millions of others in desperate need?

thomas jefferson was a deist, ask any history professor or read any history book. in fact, when he was elected president in the early 19th century, many Christians were afraid that he would infringe upon their rights.

last of all: HITLER WAS AN ULTRA-CONSERVATIVE. since when have liberals been known to be racist?


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 8:38 PM on December 28, 2002 | IP
David_B_Thompson

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Evidence, please!!!  The poles are not melting!  You say that the "ozone hole" is a problem; prove it!  That's what this forum is all about!  Where's the scientific proof?

Ignorant?  No.  I was looking for some evidence!  I'll be honest, I don't know everything about the Lott\Thurmond situation, but then, who does with the media anymore?  As far as Sen. Helms goes, if what I have heard is true, he was wrong!  However, just because someone who calls himself a "conservative" happens to be racist, that doesn't mean racism is a "principle of conservativism".  If you disagree, then Ill have to ask you to explain the liberal Sen. Robert Byrd's actions and statements!

Again, where's the evidence?  You're claiming that conservatives are anti-immigration, but where do you get that?  Give me some quotes or something!

Capitalism:  For the third time this post, evidence!  Explain how capitalism takes from the poor and gives to the rich!  I don't want a bunch of liberal propaganda, I want evidence!

You're right about one thing: Christians were concerned about the election that Jefferson would eventually win.  Why?  Because neither of the candidates openly claimed to be Christians per se.  Why should this be a concern?  Because, as John Jay (The first Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court) said, "Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty, as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation , to select and prefer Christians for their rulers."

I've already given you one example of a racist liberal, and I could give you others except for one thing: I don't have time!  (Though I may end up giving more anyway!)

Hitler: Do I really have to say it again?  Okay, evidence!!!  You've made a claim, (a false one) now give me some evidence that supports that claim!

Alright, if you want to leave all that other stuff for the appropriate forums, stick with the so-called "ozone hole".  I've given you the reasons why it really isn't a problem, so take it from there.


-------
David B. Thompson


God
Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 4:14 PM on December 30, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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you are so hypocritical. you demand for me to show evidence, but you refuse to give any VALID evidence for your beliefs (such as the non-existence of an ozone problem, and creation rather than evolution). you never back up your beliefs, so why should i have to? i'm not a scientist, but if thousands of scientists have all said that we have an ozone problem, then i'm more than likely going to believe them over you (who happens to know nothing about the subject)


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 9:28 PM on December 30, 2002 | IP
David_B_Thompson

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I've made several factual statements including:

1. The so-called "ozone hole" is actually a thinning of about 5%

2. The normal variance for the ozone layer is about 50%

3. The area of the thinning has shrunk 50% in the last two years.

From this information (which I obtained from a scientist\professor) I conclude that the thinning called the "ozone hole" is not a problem.  Can you see the difference between the 5% caused by human activity (maybe not entirely either) and the 50% that occurs naturally?  Doesn't that mean something?

If you want to question my sources, go ahead!  You're the one who believes so much in the university degree, take a look at this:

Dr. Jay L. Wile holds an earned Ph.D. from the University of Rochester in nuclear chemistry and a B.S. in chemistry from the same institution. He has won several awards for excellence in teaching and has presented numerous lectures on various topics, including Nuclear Chemistry. In addition, he has published 30 articles on these subjects in nationally-recognized journals. His teaching credentials include:


The University of Rochester
Indiana University
Ball State University
The Indiana Academy for Science, Mathematics and Humanities (a high school for gifted and talented students)

Well?  Okay, forget the source, how about the information itself?  Can you scientifically challenge any of the information I've given you?  Go ahead and try!

By the way, the majority of scientists believe that the "ozone hole" is not a problem!  Check this out, S. Fred Singer said, in his Congressional testimony: "I want to state clearly that there is no scientific consensus on ozone depletion or its consequences. "Consensus" is a political concept, not a scientific one. It is used mainly to gain reassurance for an ideological position and to avoid having to examine the scientific arguments in detail. Consensus has been claimed also for the global warming issue. The official report from the UN-sponsored Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change mentions the existence of "minority" views, but the editors could not, or perhaps would not, "accommodate" them. The IPCC editors thus achieved "consensus" by ignoring contrary evidence and dissenting views. Much the same has been true in the ozone issue."


His qualifications?  "I hold a degree in engineering from Ohio State and a Ph.D. in physics from Princeton University. For more than 40 years, I have specialized in atmospheric and space physics. I received a Special Commendation from President Eisenhower for the early design of satellites. In 1962, I established the U.S. Weather Satellite Service, served as its first director, and received a Gold Medal award from the U.S. Department of Commerce for this contribution.

Early in my career I devised the instrument used to measure stratospheric ozone from satellites. As a Deputy Assistant Administrator of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency in 1971, I chaired an interdepartmental panel of scientists looking into the possible effects on stratospheric ozone of a proposed fleet of supersonic transports (SSTs). Ours was the first group to examine possible damage to the ozone layer from human activities and look into potential health consequences, including skin cancers. During this period I published the hypothesis that anthropogenic methane, from cattle raising and rice growing, could deplete stratospheric ozone. In the late 1980s I served as Chief Scientist of the U.S. Department of Transportation and also provided expert advice to the White House on the ozone issue."

I know nothing about the subject?  Really?  You call the three scientific points I listed above nothing?  How about dealing with the evidence I've given?

The so-called "ozone hole" is a piece of liberal propaganda and has no scientific backing whatsoever!


-------
David B. Thompson


God
Bless
America!!!
 


Posts: 43 | Posted: 08:06 AM on December 31, 2002 | IP
Patriotandproudofit

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Falling,

I am sorry, but I am getting rather annoyed by the repeated attacks on Lott and Thurmond. Mind you I am not a racist, nor do I like either man in question, but I do think it is time that the truth came out.

If you take the time to look at who was what and when, you will find some rather interesting information. In 1948, the real year in question, there were two men running for national offices, and both rather new faces to the political world, there names are Strom Thurmond and Trent Lott.

Both of these men have found their names littered throughout the media over the past month or so, but interestingly enough this same media, who wishes to destroy the character of Sen. Lott and the Republican party (in which they have been partly successful, by getting Lott to step down as majority leader), almost entirely neglects the political backgroud of said comment.

Interestingly enough, when you do a little research, you find that both Sen.s Lott and Thurmond were on their respective tickets under the Dixiecrat party! Yes, that's right a branch of the Democratic party was host to both Lott and Thurmond at the time in question.


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Are you a man of the times, or a man for the times?
 


Posts: 51 | Posted: 5:20 PM on December 31, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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you do not know much about history, do you patriot? if you did, you would know that the democratic party and the republican party basically totally switched their platforms. jesse helms and strom thurmond both were democrats (or dixiecrats) until the democrats began fighting for black civil rights. then helms and thurmond switched to the republican party


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 11:28 PM on December 31, 2002 | IP
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And clansman Byrd in the Senate? Why aren't you attacking him? He used the "n" word a few years ago on FOX News... how do we know he ever got over the feelings he had in the KKK?


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Don't tell me I'm conservative...I know that!
 


Posts: 351 | Posted: 4:32 PM on January 4, 2003 | IP
fallingupwards84

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did u read what i said in response to that in the other debate forum? i said that he should have resigned


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 01:01 AM on January 5, 2003 | IP
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I believe I read somewhere that the ozone completely replenishes itself every 7 years. I'll try and find the source again, but until then, just take it as unreliable. Secondly, there isn't Abundant life at the south pole. Name for me 30 species that live on the continent of antartica. Even if you could name 50 that would hardly qualify it as a thriving eco system, or abundant life. Secondly, just supposing the Ice Caps COMPLETELY melted. What impact would that really have on the planet? Consider an ice berg. Both the north and south poles are primarily ice shelfs and so forth, with the majority of their surface under water. A simple experiment can be done, take a glass of water, fill it half way up  and insert some ice cubes so that some ice is protruding from the surface. Mark the water line and allow the ice to melt. As you'll find the displacement of the ice is greater, or depending on how much ice you added, only slightly less than the volume of water that has been solidified. The point of this, aside from enviromental propriety, is that if water levels raised at all, it would be pretty insignificant. (This is at least my layman's knowledge of how such a thing would work.) Similarly, global warming isn't the huge threat that pinky leftists would have you believe. If you look into earths past, temperature variance isn't a new thing...it's been around forever, certainly far longer than CFC's.

And here I was all amazed cause I thought FallingUpwards and I agreed on something else.


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"The Way of the Warrior is the two-fold path of pen and sword. Even if a man possess no natural inclination he may be a warrior by sticking assidously to both divisions of the Way."

-Shinmen Musashi
 


Posts: 112 | Posted: 11:37 PM on April 26, 2003 | IP
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ooops scratch that last comment, it's Exxos that I agree with, and that's not too common.


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"The Way of the Warrior is the two-fold path of pen and sword. Even if a man possess no natural inclination he may be a warrior by sticking assidously to both divisions of the Way."

-Shinmen Musashi
 


Posts: 112 | Posted: 11:38 PM on April 26, 2003 | IP
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That 5% variable in the South only happens during the Poler Vortex. This happens on a seasonal basis. The Poler Vortex is like a giant invisible tornado.


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Darkside Enterprises were the impossible meets possible.

Tread softy and carry a big stick, preferably an AT4
 


Posts: 681 | Posted: 10:56 PM on January 9, 2007 | IP
Scottd

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Variables are far higher.

However the ozone is not the issue with global warming. I'm not sure how so many peopel get this wrong. It due to a thickening of our atmosphere, not allowing heat to escape back into space at normal levels. THat is happening, it isn't made up, nor is it speculation.

Ozone is generated by other things in nature. However, those natural resources are decreasing. Only so much healing wil take place over so much time. Ozone is also not stationary.

THe thiining of the ozone is a smaller probem. Where the ozone has thinned other gases have thickened.





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You state the bible condems Gay love. But the also also allows slavery and states woman serve their husband and are less then them, but you do not obey that? It is clear the bible has been rewritten by man, and the word of god is lost.
 


Posts: 16 | Posted: 11:07 PM on January 16, 2008 | IP
Scottd

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LEt's clarify the Polar VOrtex which is the correct name.

It's located near  Earth's poles, in the middle to upper troposphere and  stratosphere or our atmosphere.

nitric acid in stratospheric clouds react with CFCs to form chlorine, which catalyzes the photochemical destruction of ozone.

What was left out above is the changes in this vortex as well as how another phenominon creates ozone to replace it. THe vortex itself and the other work to distribute Ozone properly, a balance effect.

However it has increased in the past 15 years. THat was left out. Luckily it isn't severe. YOu see the balnce of other sreams affect it, and they are now decreasing, knocking the flow off.

However the ozone reduction increases are not caused by the Vortex, certainly at opposite poles. Even with the Ozone destruction on a natural level there, the ozone thinning, does not exist in that region. Yet it does in areas affected by industry. Hummmm.



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You state the bible condems Gay love. But the also also allows slavery and states woman serve their husband and are less then them, but you do not obey that? It is clear the bible has been rewritten by man, and the word of god is lost.
 


Posts: 16 | Posted: 11:23 PM on January 16, 2008 | IP
SilverStar

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Even if the fluctuations were 15% that would still be far below the 50% random fluctuations of the rest of the world.



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Darkside Enterprises were the impossible meets possible.

Tread softy and carry a big stick, preferably an AT4
 


Posts: 681 | Posted: 01:15 AM on March 30, 2008 | IP
    
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