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What degree of gun control should we have ? 

http://www.youdebate.com/DEBATES/guncontrol.HTM

(Edited by admin 10/8/2002 at 6:51 PM).
 


Posts: 31 | Posted: 09:56 AM on May 1, 2002 | IP
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Its a sticky issue, but I'll explain why I go for PRO gun control.

1) The single purpose and design of a gun is to kill things. Living things. With hand guns, assault rifles; usually people.

2) If your government or another is suppressing your liberty, and the populace truely rises up against it - truely nothing can stop it. Guns aren't needed in the meanwhile. And besides your government and any other government capable of invading has vast amounts of every type of weapon imaginable, guns in themselves won't help.

3) Controlling by age works only partially, if a person doesn't know their own mind by 18 or whenever, then 21/25/etc won't be much better. Gun control should be more complete than ages.

4) Outlaws that kill with guns are not top notch outlaws, more usually the mugger and the penny thieves. The phrase "If you outlaw guns then only outlaws will have guns" is only partially true since outlaws of course can get guns, but gun deaths arn't just caused by criminals that (in truely controled environment) would have to go out of their way to get one.

5) Guns as self-defense?!? Where do you live that you need to kill with a gun to viably protect yourself? Passive security and avoiding bad situations are far more productive.

Still. There are good CON arguments and the debate's extremes tend to wipe them selves out. So it comes down to a gutfeeling really. Does our society need guns or not? One less freely availible weapon for killing mightn't improve things much, but it certainly won't harm society.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 8:27 PM on August 19, 2002 | IP
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The only gun deaths that can be prevented are self defense deaths, and accidental deaths. Given that killing a criminal in self defense is not something we should aim to curtail, the focus of gun laws should be to help prevent accidental deaths.

I think that to legally own a gun, you should be required to have a gun license. Only one license would be necessary, for any number of guns.

The license would simply state that you have an undserstanding of basic gun handling, firings, and storage safety.

Gun owners knowing how to safetly store thier weapons, and prevent children from aquiring those weapons, will greatly reduce the number of accidental gun deaths and injuries.


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Posts: 30 | Posted: 10:30 PM on August 19, 2002 | IP
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an extremely high degree.  Guns are bad, and if they get loose at all, they can end up killing anyone.  Just use knives, they are less lethal.  Also use tazers.  If guns are absolutely needed, then put 50 locks on them.


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I am Exxoss, come to save you all from your impending doom!!!!
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Posts: 438 | Posted: 3:12 PM on September 25, 2002 | IP
therut

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Personally I do not think gun control reduces gun violence.  However when talking about gun control a few questions need to be answered before talking about specific laws.  One does the congress have the power to regulate guns and to what extent given its constitutional powers.  Next does the regulation offend the 2nd amendment,   and third does the law really prevent gun crime, or accidents and what are the unintended consequences.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:31 PM on September 28, 2002 | IP
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YES!!! Thank you thank you thank you! I LOVE Constitutional law/ govt powers debates!

1st, while congress probably does not have power to do any real gun control (though it does have power to regulate), the states do.  Quilici v. Morton Grove  allowed the city of Morton Grove to ban all hand guns in its city limits. period. so a state level solution would work out fine. this is consistant with the 2nd amendment.


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"If stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?" -Will Rodgers<br><br><br>"Neither man nor nation can prosper unless in looking at the present, thought is steadily taken for the future." -T. Roosevelt<br><br>"Might I remind you that extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue." -Barry Goldwater<br><br>

Respect through Excellence only
 


Posts: 789 | Posted: 2:58 PM on September 30, 2002 | IP
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State and city level gun control and gun bans might be consistant with the 2nd Amendment, but often they would be inconsistant with "right to keep and bear arms" protections found in a majority of state constitutions.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 07:51 AM on October 13, 2002 | IP
therut

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The question is ----when will the USSC incorporate the 2nd amendment to the states under the 14th amendment.  If they ever did this probably most state gun control laws would be unconstitutional.This is a very interesting aspect to learn about.  A good place to start is at the guncite  web page.  Once there look under the second amendment law library where there are many law review articles from both sides of the isle.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 8:32 PM on October 13, 2002 | IP
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Quote from therut at 8:32 PM on October 13, 2002 :
The question is ----when will the USSC incorporate the 2nd amendment to the states under the 14th amendment.  If they ever did this probably most state gun control laws would be unconstitutional.This is a very interesting aspect to learn about.  A good place to start is at the guncite  web page.  Once there look under the second amendment law library where there are many law review articles from both sides of the isle.
To do this would either force the Supreme Court to say whether the Second allows for gun bans, or whether no gun control is Constitutional.
They won't do this.


 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 01:23 AM on October 14, 2002 | IP
therut

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I disagree they may not want to have to decide this but eventually they will have to.  If you consider the militia clause in the main body of the constitution that deals with the  power of the federal government to call up the militia.  If a state completely banned firearms a state them would be denying the federal government of an effective militia to call up.  Like I said this is a very interesting thing to really read some law articles about. When the constitution was being debated the anti-federalists thought the constitution gave too much power to the federal government over the militia.  Not that anyone thought any  government body would ever disarm citizens but that if you note the congress does not have to arm or keep up the militia.  They could but were to mandated to.  So one reason for the 2nd amendment giving the right to the people was that it took care of that problem in that individuals have a right to keep and bear arms therefore if the federal government failed to not provide for the militia the militia would still be maintained by the people.  Actually congress has the power to actually arm the citizens if it so wished.  Hey they could pass a bill buying and distributing to all citizens a fully automatic rifle. Actually look up the civilian markmanship program.  This is a program set up by congress to train citizens and allow you to buy a M!-Garand.  This is still much in use.  Although Clinton had it put in a bill to not fund it.  Although the program is still up and running the cost of the rifle is more.  This is the Congress arming the militia under it's militia clause.  Most people don't even realize this program exists just like they do not realize the NRA was established by a 20,000 grant from congress to teach markmanship.  The citizens have totally been misled by the media and the left in this country.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 2:02 PM on October 14, 2002 | IP
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The 14th amendment was passed after the civil war.  However the USSC began incorporating the rights in the BOR to the states in 1897 piece by piece instead of doing what congress really wanted.  This is why the Jim Crow laws were unfortunally allowed to go on for so long. All of the BOR has been incorported to the states except the 2nd, 3rd ,7th part of the 5th and part of the 8th.  However it was the intent of congress to incorportae all by this amendment.   Let me quote Rep. John Bingham the author of the 14th amendment---"Mr. Speaker, that the scope and meaning of the limitations imposed by the first section,fourteenth amendment of the Constitution may be more fully understood, permit me to say that the privilages and immunities of citizens of the United States...are chiefly defined in the first 8 amendments to the Constitution of the United States.  Those eight amendments are as folled(Bingham then goes on to recite the first eight amendments).These eight articles I have shown never were limitations upon the power of the States, until made so by the 14th amendment.  The words of that amendment ..are an express prohibition upon every state in the Union.  This is why the Anti-2nd amendment backers do not  in any way want a USSC that will rule an individual right.  They know this would have to be addressed next.  They have tried to rewrite history and misled and demonize guns at every instance since the 1960's.  Within the past 15 years many law scholars who are liberal and for gun control have finally done their research and admit the NRA interpretaion is right. I think this is one reason Senator Schumer is so adament to bring "ideology" into the debate on appointing Judges.  He expects to grill them on their interpretation of the 2nd amendment>
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 4:24 PM on October 14, 2002 | IP
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All you pro gun control people are not very intelligent are you. Because guns don't kill people, it's the person behind the gun that kill people.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:38 AM on November 1, 2002 | IP
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Lets look at this problem statisticly shall we?

Australia and England have a total ban on guns in their country.

This would make you think they were peaceful huh?

You know what country has the highest murder rate in the world? ...Australia

And behind them in a close second... Enlgand.

It is estimated that one million rapes and murders are prevented in America a year because of guns.

"Hand guns are a girls best friend" ..you ban guns, the only people that arnt going to have them are innocent people.


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Posts: 293 | Posted: 3:14 PM on November 2, 2002 | IP
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Sakata I might have to say this is the first time I have ever agreed with you.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 11:07 PM on November 3, 2002 | IP
Sakata

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Ah, see Tsmith? your coming around ;)


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No time for mediocrity.

People call me a Bible-Thumping reactionist ...and I'm proud to bear the name.
 


Posts: 293 | Posted: 10:33 PM on November 4, 2002 | IP
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No kid, I believe its the other way around, you are coming around.


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 01:05 AM on November 5, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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they dont have a total ban...you just need to get a license..and it is expensive and hard to get, but handguns are outlawed.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 09:59 AM on November 5, 2002 | IP
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1) The single purpose and design fo a gun is to launch a projectile from the end of the barrel.  However, I know of nothing manufactured anywhere in the world that has one and only one purpose, either directly or inferred.

2) May I call your attention to the American Civil War?  One part of the United States no longer wanted to be a part of the whole.  If your line of reasoning is correct, then the CSA should have successfully seceded. However, that was not the case.  Truly, something did stop it.

3) A rule exists that prohibits a certain behavior.  There exist people who ignore the rules. Therefore we pass more rules to further prohibit those people who ignore the rules.  Is this correct?

4) It would appear that those persons whom you have labled outlaws already 'go out of their way' to get what they want.  We could make the same argument for drugs.  In my community, it is against the law to use, obtain, or otherwise be in posession of cocaine.  Violating this law is supposed to incur hefty penalties.  So does this mean that it is impossible for a person to obtain cocaine in my community?  If not, we should pass more laws, don't you think?

5) Are you saying that I do not need a gun to protect myself?  I could just be passive (please explain what you mean) or use avoidance to protect myself?  What if I use a knife, or a stick, or a rock and kill someone who breaks into my home?  Kind of hard to avoid them if they're in my living room.  Would that be ok?  I mean, the poor burglar will be just as dead, but at least it won't be another gun death to add to the statistics list?

If someone wants to kill someone, lethal force is lethal force, no matter if that lethal force is 170 grains of lead, or 1.2 ounces of arsenic, 32 oz of Louisville slugger, or 250 lbs of php laced human flesh.  It's all about intention, the tool is secondary to the outcome.
 


Posts: 3 | Posted: 7:04 PM on November 13, 2002 | IP
madbilly

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*clap**clap*..you need a standing ovation..i am totally in agreeance.


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my name is madbilly....what did you expect me to be happy when my name says Mad in it...
 


Posts: 451 | Posted: 11:40 PM on November 13, 2002 | IP
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I totally agree with the fact that if you try to outlaw guns its just going to make the problem even worse & more seious. Taking away guns infringes upon the 2nd Ammendment, the right to bear arms. And there are too many people opposing the subject so it'd never pass as a law in the US in the near future, especially because of the "War on Terrorism", it makes people feel safe, kinda like a safety blanket. So as long as these people dont go out & shoot people its ok, because the government has laws against that to try & prevent that thing from happening.
**Emz**
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:09 AM on November 14, 2002 | IP
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I think we need MORE guns- mainly hand guns. Now before you go storming off about how wrong this is think of this: I live in Arizona now, where it is quite legal to carry a handgun and possible to obtain a concealed carry permit. We have a VERY low crime rate because criminals don't know if the person they are about to mug has a gun! Most criminals (not all) are lazy, and cowardly. Why else would they steal from others instead of gettin g a job, ect... But anyway, is the risk of death/serious bodily harm really worth the $50 they would get from stealing a purse of wallet? The more they think, the more they relise the risks do not outwieght the potential harm of a armed populace.


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Posts: 134 | Posted: 3:45 PM on December 5, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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your crazy. if we outlawed guns (or at least put tougher restrictions on them), then criminals would not have as much access to guns and as a result people wouldnt hafta worry about carrying a gun in self-defense


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 7:10 PM on December 5, 2002 | IP
Bograt

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I dissagree, falling. If we put even more laws on the books, then it would only make it more difficult for regular people to buy guns. If a criminal really wants a gun, he/she is not going to use legal channels to get it. Least of all wait the manditory 2-week "cooling off" time from purchase to pickup. (which is a good idea IMO)


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Damn you Murphy!
 


Posts: 134 | Posted: 8:25 PM on December 5, 2002 | IP
Maynard

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Quote from fallingupwards84 at 7:10 PM on December 5, 2002 :
your crazy. if we outlawed guns (or at least put tougher restrictions on them), then criminals would not have as much access to guns and as a result people wouldnt hafta worry about carrying a gun in self-defense


open your damn eyes.  how many crimals do you know buy their guns legally anyway?  i know for a fact there are very few.

i grew up in an area with many gangs, there is also a gun shop in the neighborhood, guess how many gang members bought guns from that shop.  ill tell ya none.  

stop saying that gun control will stop crimanals from getting guns, its a pointless arguement and is a line of BS.  and tell whoever is telling you that to stop brainwashing you.




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I love my country, but fear my government.

your friendly ultra-conservative patriot.
 


Posts: 270 | Posted: 1:19 PM on December 6, 2002 | IP
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here is a though: look at prohibition. Good idea? maybe. Outlawing alchohol was a good idea in theory, but look at what happened. It was still there, plain as day but people WANTED it, so the smart (if not shady) element went to work to provide the people who wanted it. Thing is, there already IS a "shady" side in the gun trade, so no matter what laws are passed, the criminals will still have there guns! (note: I do like gettin' wasted every now and again)


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Damn you Murphy!
 


Posts: 134 | Posted: 1:57 PM on December 6, 2002 | IP
kelvin90703

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"Just use knives, they are less lethal."

You gotta be kidding me.  An average man can cover 21 ft. and deliver a fatal knife blow in the time it takes a police officer to discharge one round.

If I have to defend my life I don't want a fair fight.

A sad truth is a handgun really is a poor tool for self defense.  A determined attacker can still deliver a fatal blow to a person after being shot with a handgun.

A typical quip by knowlegeable people is that: "I use my handgun to fight may way back to my assault rifle."
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:11 PM on December 8, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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funny that bograt and maynard say "outlawing something like guns would be pointless because people will buy them anyway." and then you go around and say that we should outlaw abortion. now i think we should outlaw abortion as well, but do you think there will still be underground abortions if we do? of course there will! does that mean we should keep it legal? nope


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 03:00 AM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Maynard

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i didnt say anything about abortion, except that i am not a woman so it isnt my place to say, its their right.  

but guns are my right, and i know there are many people out there that use guns and other means to create crime, and i know for one i am not bowing down to them, they want to rob me, they are taking a few bullets with them.  

you and many others keep saying the outlawing guns will reduce gun crime.  and it wont, there is a place, Virgin Utah, that has a gun control law, everybody must have a gun, gueass their gun crime rate is? there isnt one.  instead of banning guns there should be easily accessable gun protection classes.  parents should teach their kids not to be afraid of guns and treat them with respect.


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I love my country, but fear my government.

your friendly ultra-conservative patriot.
 


Posts: 270 | Posted: 12:19 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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hmmm Virgin Utah...doesnt sound like the kind of place that would have any kind of crime. but i guarantee you if everyone in Los Angelas or New York owned a gun, there would be an astronomical increase in murders.


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 3:15 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Pie

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LA and NY have some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation, and also some of the highest crime rates. Gun control doesn't work.


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Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:15 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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think about it. NY and LA have always had more crime than other cities. no matter what gun laws they have, there will always be crime. so you cant use those two cities as an example of cities where gun control does not work


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 8:44 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Pie

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Please link to a reliable source where you got this information.


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A Mac is to a PC is what a Lamborghini is to a Honda Civic.
 


Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:46 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Pie

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Or, if you were just making it up, don't. Also, by the logic you use, more gun control wouldn't reduce the US of A's already high crime rate. Therefor, you should not be pressing for it.


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A Mac is to a PC is what a Lamborghini is to a Honda Civic.
 


Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:50 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Maynard

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Quote from fallingupwards84 at 8:44 PM on December 9, 2002 :
think about it. NY and LA have always had more crime than other cities. no matter what gun laws they have, there will always be crime. so you cant use those two cities as an example of cities where gun control does not work



they are also some of the most populated cities in america, so of course there is going to be more crime.



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I love my country, but fear my government.

your friendly ultra-conservative patriot.
 


Posts: 270 | Posted: 10:04 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
Pie

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In case you peeps didn't know, I was refering to the crime rate. The actual number of crimes will, of course, be much higher.


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Posts: 202 | Posted: 10:17 PM on December 9, 2002 | IP
tsmith2771

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What does a name of a city have anything to do with what the crime rate is?


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"I have no interest in making blacks equal to whites, they are of a lesser quality and this I am sure of." -Abraham Lincoln
"You don't win a war by dying for your country, you win a war by making the other person die for theirs." -General George Patton
 


Posts: 372 | Posted: 05:40 AM on December 10, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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first of all Pie, you are being hypocritical. you demand for me to give sources for my information? why dont you give sources for your information. you just expect me to blindly accept that NY and LA have tough gun laws?
secondly Maynard, the crime rate is what i was referring too. there is more crime per person. i hope someone as intelligent as you will be understand what that means


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 09:37 AM on December 10, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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i would like to hear alex's point of view about gun control...we could all benefit from his wonderful logic


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 09:38 AM on December 10, 2002 | IP
Maynard

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Quote from fallingupwards84 at 09:37 AM on December 10, 2002 :
Maynard, the crime rate is what i was referring too. there is more crime per person. i hope someone as intelligent as you will be understand what that means



its finals week, give me a break



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I love my country, but fear my government.

your friendly ultra-conservative patriot.
 


Posts: 270 | Posted: 2:43 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
Pie

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GunCite
The Cody Express
These are both very good sites for falling to check up on my facts.


"you just expect me to blindly accept that NY and LA have tough gun laws?" If you don't know this, you should stay off of the subject.

Quote by Me:" Also, by the logic you use, more gun control wouldn't reduce the US of A's already high crime rate. Therefor, you should not be pressing for it."
Before you call me a hypocrite, it's best to back yourself up. Have anything to add here, or do you want to expose yourself?


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Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:26 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
fallingupwards84

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my point is that no matter what laws NY and LA have, they will ALWAYS have a higher crime rate (although gun control reduces it). i'm sorry, but Virgin Utah (the example you gave) is never going to have the same crime RATE as NY and LA. sorry to disappoint you


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i am a liberal chrisitian and proud of it!!!

"Those who produce should have, but we know that those who produce the most - that is, those who work hardest, and at the most difficult and most menial tasks, have the least." - Eugene Debs
 


Posts: 971 | Posted: 10:45 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
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fallingupwards said, "...no matter what laws NY and LA have, they will ALWAYS have a higher crime rate (although gun control reduces it)..."

Virtually every time that gun control is introduced, the crime rate skyrockets.  Check the crime statistics for Australia and England.  Closer to home, check the stats for Washington D. C.  I'm not as familiar with those from NY or LA, but I'd be willing to bet that they mirror the results of the other examples provided.

Citizens in those areas don't have an effective means of self defense.  Criminals move where its least dangerous to do business.
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 11:40 PM on December 10, 2002 | IP
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"my point is that no matter what laws NY and LA have, they will ALWAYS have a higher crime rate (although gun control reduces it). "Find me stats and facts to back this up.  As Guest said, in areas where gun control is increased, crime rates rise. I was searching Google earler on and came across some of these stats, I'll go see if I can find 'em.




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Posts: 202 | Posted: 01:25 AM on December 11, 2002 | IP
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Quote from fallingupwards84 at 10:45 PM on December 10, 2002 :
but Virgin Utah (the example you gave) is never going to have the same crime RATE as NY and LA. sorry to disappoint you


really? oh i am sure glad you told me that.  dont think i would of figured that out on my own.  but if it works for a small town like Virgin, why not anywhere else.  I am not saying that there should be laws requiring guns, there is somepeople i wouldnt  trust with a blunted pencil, but there shouldnt be anylaw to stop guns period.



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I love my country, but fear my government.

your friendly ultra-conservative patriot.
 


Posts: 270 | Posted: 09:14 AM on December 11, 2002 | IP
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Here's a quote for you all to think about in this subject:

--- "For the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient. The world will follow our lead." ---
ADOLPH HITLER - 1935

I really, really, don't want America to be like 1940 Germany.




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- Patriot
 


Posts: 6 | Posted: 9:20 PM on January 10, 2003 | IP
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I must apologise for the quote in my above post. I have, since posting it, found information that claims it is a false quote! The website that made that claim was pro-gun, so I took that to be credible. If you want to check it out yourself, here is the URL:

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcbogus.html

I will, however, not back down from my pro-gun stance. Instead of this quote, I'll add a Constitutional facet to this debate

The 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution should settle all debate in this area for America. It says,

"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

Fortunately, I do not need to go into a debate defining the "militia" refered to in the first clause of the 2nd Amendment, because the second clause states that the right of the people to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Webster's 1828 Dictionary defines the word "infringed" as follows:

1. To break; as contracts; to violate, either positively by contravention, or negatively by non-fulfillment or neglect of performance.
2. To break; to violate; to transgress; to neglect to fulfill or obey; as, to infringe a law.
3. To destroy or hinder; as, to infringe efficacy.

As this definition clearly shows, the Founders never intended for gun control of any sort. The right to keep and bear arms cannot even be infringed. Therefore, any form of gun control in the United States of America is unconstitutional.



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- Patriot
 


Posts: 6 | Posted: 4:51 PM on January 19, 2003 | IP
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Will there EVER be a non-biased gun FACT site? Not a pro gun or anti gun site, but one with real facts and no reason to screw around with them?


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Damn you Murphy!
 


Posts: 134 | Posted: 9:19 PM on January 22, 2003 | IP
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Hallo Everyone,

I was reading these posts in this forum, as well as topics of similar issue at other forums and to me it all ends up in one question: Why do you Americans need guns?
I am swedish and have lived in Spain, France and I am now living in Germany, and I never needed a gun to protect myself. I even never had the feeling of needing one.
I am asking, what do you people fear?
What threatens you so much, that you have to arm yourself?
To me a gun is just an instrument of violence. I read some posts discussing statistics. i personally don't give to much about statistics, they just try to put socialization in a mathematic order, but american homicide rate doesn't need any interpretation.
So if guns work so greatly for your safety, why isn't America the safest place in the world?

Greetings,
Sören
 


Posts: 0 | Posted: 8:08 PM on January 29, 2003 | IP
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"Why do you Americans need guns?"

If you had the same crime rate as the US, you'd want guns, too.

"I am asking, what do you people fear?"

With far over 10,000 murders per year, there is plenty to fear.

"So if guns work so greatly for your safety, why isn't America the safest place in the world?"

Guns are used in the US to far greater good than evil (2.5 million defensive uses per year as compared to far fewer injuries cause by 'em), and, if you'd look, you would see that much of crime in the US emenates from the states with restricive firearms laws.


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A Mac is to a PC is what a Lamborghini is to a Honda Civic.
 


Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:39 PM on January 29, 2003 | IP
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"Why do you Americans need guns?"

If you had the same crime rate as the US, you'd want guns, too.

"I am asking, what do you people fear?"

With far over 10,000 murders per year, there is plenty to fear.

"So if guns work so greatly for your safety, why isn't America the safest place in the world?"

Guns are used in the US to far greater good than evil (2.5 million defensive uses per year as compared to far fewer injuries cause by 'em), and, if you'd look, you would see that much of crime in the US emenates from the states with restricive firearms laws.


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A Mac is to a PC is what a Lamborghini is to a Honda Civic.
 


Posts: 202 | Posted: 8:45 PM on January 29, 2003 | IP
    
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